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Post by Abayomi Oluwatoyin on Jun 3, 2020 21:53:50 GMT
Standard English is useful mostly in official domains and has a set of rules for use while the non-standard English is used for communicative purposes. Yes, communicative because it is with the use of this form of English that the competence of a user or mostly speaker is discovered. I grew up speaking the non-standard form and it helped a lot with the grasping of the standard form when I started school.
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Tom Le Seelleur Lisburn, NI
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Post by Tom Le Seelleur Lisburn, NI on Jun 7, 2020 7:17:29 GMT
The analogy is too simplistic as is the premise that 'standard English' is something evil or a conspiracy. You teach English in countries and try to unite the local variation of English with the one you use personally. As I speak southern English that is my standard and it just so happens to be the one being analysed in this course.
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Post by Ed on Jun 7, 2020 19:44:38 GMT
I don't think I like the analogy. One reason is that it conjures up a very euro-centric image.
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Post by Sally Urquhart on Jun 9, 2020 14:53:43 GMT
I like the analogy of ‘standard English’ being the linguistic equivalent of a dress code or rules for table etiquette. It is true that we behave and dress differently at black tie events than we do for a visit to the McDonalds drive through. We speak differently in business meetings than we do at the pub with friends on a Friday night. It also fits because table etiquette and dress code is also something that (I think) is evolving for a majority, and there will be a minority in a certain demographic who will stick strictly to these ‘rules’, and also do not agree that language is fluid.
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Post by Jellow on Jun 11, 2020 15:56:07 GMT
Language somehow needs to be contextualized.
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Post by beatrizguerra on Jun 16, 2020 17:47:59 GMT
I can see why there's an analogy between Standard English and dress code or table etiquette rules. We live in a diverse society, with different costumes and beliefs. We, as social beings, tend to settle rules for different social occasions, as a way to define which is the correct and the wrong form of behavior during such events. As there are some occasions in which people expect a specific kind of dress code, the same occurs in the use of language. And when it comes to Standard English there are plenty of rules to follow so we can achieve social praise, as well as dress code and table etiquette rules.
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Post by evarojo on Jun 16, 2020 20:12:51 GMT
The analogy between dress code or table etiquette to standard English suits itself. Like a dress code for an event the English speaker can choose when and where to use, to whom and even why. I mean, there are many native speakers of English who switch from their regional and local varieties to a more general version of English whenever they feel they have a need to do so, imagine a formal job interview. But I do not believe in a standard English to be imposed on people as the superior variety of English, like dress code or table etiquette is quite snobbish. Most of the time you do not even bother. I grew up with that wrong concept of the standard English being the one to be learnt and spoken, later to realize than there were multiple Englishes: Cockney English, Liverpudian, Mancunian, to just cite a few. They enrich English as a whole.
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lisa
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Post by lisa on Jun 21, 2020 8:34:56 GMT
Dress codes and etiquette is what is expected of us and considered correct depending on the context. I like the point someone made about slurping soup. I had a similar experience with burping openly after a meal, which in some cultures is perfectly acceptable and considered a sign of appreciation. We are constantly adapting our language depending on the situation even with other native speakers. My Bradford accent becomes more pronounced when I speak to me mum for instance and however in clsss with my students my accent is not so pronounced, not because I think my Bradford accent is less correct but because it is not maybe as intelligible to students. Also my accent has changed over the years living in different countries and being surrounding by other varieties of English. We are constantly adapting to our environment and modifying our behaviors and language to what is appropriate in that situation. What we need to do is celebrate the beauty of all these different varieties and move towards giving them a more equal status, modifying testing criteria to reflect this.
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Post by marian on Jun 25, 2020 19:50:25 GMT
Perhaps what Marianna Pascal was showing in her Toastmasters Speech Contest reflects what happens when the native language interferes with ESL. The example she gave about the blender reminded me of the phrases some students write when they are thinking in their mother tongue and they translate word by word. As I share their mother tongue, it is easier for me to guess what they are trying to say. However, I always insist on the fact that native English speakers may not understand what they are trying to say and therefore it is essential for them to "think in English" and use Standard English structures properly.
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Post by Anita on Jun 29, 2020 10:06:37 GMT
I totally agree with the comparison that 'Standard English’ are just the linguistic equivalent of a dress code or rules for table etiquette. This is often the case in a formal setting. While in an informal setting, we deviate from Standard English to embrace our own dialects or localized English for social reasons, one of which is sense of belonging to the community.
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mkhan
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Post by mkhan on Jul 13, 2020 9:03:09 GMT
I totally agree.
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Post by Ulla on Jul 24, 2020 11:26:02 GMT
Watching the video made me think about idiomatic expressions. In my opinion, these can be a barrier to understanding, no matter if they are 'standard English' idioms or belong to some regional variety. I would argue that "I'll give you a ride" is not necessarily more immediately comprehensible than the local meaning of "you follow me" in this talk. You would have to say something simple like "I can drive you there".
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Post by miabae on Aug 1, 2020 17:00:21 GMT
While I understand the use and implementation of the language standard in testing/assessment and with less proficient users, I am all for introducing the variety of dialects to advanced students.
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Post by Rachel Dry on Aug 18, 2020 16:28:24 GMT
Which is the best English? One American teacher said to me: The one that makes yourself understood . This is GREAT! As a native speaker it makes me sad to think that this ideology of 'Standard English' can have such a detrimental impact on students and non native speaking teachers who feel that they will never achieve this and consequently feel alienated by their own way of speaking English. I completely agree that at times we must scrutinise our students for not following 'standardised' grammar rules despite their ability to successfully communicate meaning. On the other hand, I can also see how in international situations the use of local dialect and idioms would not be appropriate for use with a number of non native speakers. In this case it is possible to see how a standardised Lingua Franca would be beneficial. However, the 'English' spoken in that room with multiple non natives would be far from the idolised Standard English it would in itself be a unique mix in which Andrea's comment is fitting.. the best English the one that makes yourself understood.
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Post by Vernell on Oct 22, 2020 16:58:59 GMT
Wow quite a lot of awesome tips. Best Essay writing ethics dilemma
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